Thu, 16 October 2008
From NBC.com:
BABY SHOWER | 10/16.2008 | 9/8c TV-PG  ------------- Post your thoughts/comments below, and remember to join Kevin and me in the TWSS Chat Room during and after the show.
Category:general
-- posted at: 8:33am EST
Comments[59]
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Loved that Michael let go of Jan as he hugged Holly; hated the stroller silliness. In defense of Matt...if anyone wants to hear over-the-top praise and blind compliments of the show there are other podcasts. TWSS is the only Office podcast I listen to anymore precisely for the kind of critical analysis Matt offers. Otherwise what\'s the point? Matt, I bet you\'re a great teacher. (Oh, and Kevin, I heart you too.) Thanks for giving me something to look forward to between episodes.
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Brandon -- you\'re complaining that the voicemail thing was used before, but in the same post you ask for \"a Karen for Pam\"? Really? I thought the bumper at the end was perfect -- they spent the episode flirting with the usual sitcom tropes (once the couple is together, they have to break up because the writers can\'t think of anything to do with them), but the end showed us that Jim and Pam ARE still totally in-synch with each other, even when they\'re not together. I applaud the writers for trying to prove that you CAN tell stories with a couple that IS together, and not just one that\'s TRYING to get together like every other show on the planet. That said, I am anxiously awaiting Fancy New Beasley\'s return to Scranton. I didn\'t think this was the best episode either, but I liked it enough.
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Blake -- You make a good point, but seriously, you didn\'t feel like the Jim/Pam \'we can\'t ever talk on the phone without a million distractions\' plot line was completely disinteresting? Not too mention terribly unrealistic? I\'ve had three long distance relationships in my life, and not a night went by that we wouldn\'t make time to talk before bed. I\'m in your corner that I\'d like to see the couple be happy for a while, but then again, conflict moves plot, and to make up unrealistic situations in order to conjure up some fake conflict in \'connectivity\' between Jim and Pam was boring to me. Maybe it was just me... And a Karen for Pam could be a number of things. But she\'s away at college and, up until this point in her life has had two major relationships and no flings to speak of unless you count the freedom fries douchebag. I say they writers tap into her repression and let her step out in the big city a little bit. She\'s such a sweet character that having those type of new feelings of wanting to experience more before marriage would be natural and an intriguing look at her personality.
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The reason I preferred this episode to last week\'s was in the way the dealt with Michael/Holly. Last week it felt like they spent 23 minutes trying to convince us the pair would work even through bumps in the road, and well, it just felt like they were shoving it down our throats. This week though, they brought in Holly\'s foil, and they let us decide for ourselves a little bit. Last week they didn\'t even put Pam in the episode because they couldn\'t spare a moment. This week felt more balanced, more stories were able to develop besides Michael/Holly, and I laughed more often. The montage of Michael holding babies is really pretty sweet and it gives you the impression that Michael is meant to be a good father. In the end, when he doesn\'t want to hold Astrid, it\'s a subtle way of showing he\'s completely over Jan. The hug confirms it and kicks off that romance in such a subtle and understated way. Speaking of understated, Dwight was not. But I still laughed my butt off when the stroller was strapped to the Trans Am. Product placement, yes, but hey, this is NBC we\'re talking about here. When your favorite shows is a byproduct of the corporate beast, you have to live with corporate influence and hope the writers can make you laugh in doing so. I felt they did that this week. I also think a fetishist has infiltrated the writing staff. Last week cuckolding, this week golden showers, next week a foot-smooshing-food fetish perhaps, ala King of the Hill? (BRING BACK MIKEY SCHUR!) Not winning any favor with Matt on this one - but the Darryl/Michael \"Baby Mama\" exchange was funny. Michael using air quotes over \"white\" was good stuff. Also, no Angela/Dwight meetings to hump was nice for me, and I\'m actually starting to enjoy Andy and Angela as a couple. Andy is really pretty sweet around her consistently, and that makes you want to root for him. I agree with Matt that making Dwight unsympathetic is a huge key to the success of the show. Finally, give Jim/Pam some real drama. The voicemail thing was already used three years ago when Packer crapped on Michael\'s carpet and Jim had to spend the day in the annex. They need to introduce a Karen for Pam to spice up this season.
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I didn\'t think this was a great episode overall, except the sincere moments between Holly and Michael, and Jim and Pam. I agree with the product placements in the show are getting too much. They spent a lot of time on the stroller and there was no pay off in the end.
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I thought this episode was okay. Didn\'t love it, didn\'t hate it. Just have to say though that this is BY FAR the best Office podcast out there. THANK YOU Matt and Kevin for your thoughtful analysis and discussion on each episode. I may not always agree with your opinions but I always enjoy listening. Also, I vote for no extra music.
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I don\'t expect to love every minute of every episode. I want every minute to be great but I don\'t think it can be. I\'m just so glad the writer\'s strike is over and we have these episodes. I can live with \"hit and miss\". We are never going to all agree on parts we like. I think there is enough for everyone that this is still working so well. We\'re obviously invested in these characters. I\'m loving the parts of this episode I loved. This works well enough for me. I can live with the moments I didn\'t love knowing someone else (with different tastes) probably did.
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Matt, not sure why you\'re getting so much hate from the peanut gallery out there before you\'ve even posted the podcast, but I agree with Erin that I really enjoy that you guys take time out of your lives to do it. I am consistently entertained by it. Heather\'s post above is the one I agree with the most. I thought there was quite a bit of funny in there. I guess overall, this is one episode where the parts are better than the sum... Just a funny note though. My husband and I were trying to get our 3-week old baby to calm down while we were drawing his bathwater tonight. We sang \"Son of a Preacher Man\" to him while we were getting everything set, and it worked! He went from red and screaming to a regular pink and calm. Also, you can wash a 3-week-old baby from head to toe in the time it takes you to sing \"Desperado\". Just a tip out there for other new parents like myself. Looking forward to the podcast this week guys b/c our household can\'t figure out who we want to win the ALCS. The Sox, the champs who hail from where I spent 2 glorious years in my 20s, or the Rays, who have most of their roster from our local Durham Bulls where we have season tickets. Tricky....
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For the most part I really loved this episode! I especially loved the performances by the cast even when they were in the background of a scene. Some of the best things I noticed were all of Creed\'s facial expressions. Dwight drinking the remainder of his water that \"broke\".The \"difficult to duplicate\" sharpie markings on the watermelon seen when Michael was eating it. Also Meredith drinking (Vodka?) from a baby bottle during the shower. Love your podcast BTW
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Angela taking the goofy baby picture was totally in character. Andy\\\'s reaction to Angela\\\'s baby picture was great. The Dwight giving birth scene was disturbing but there was something semi gross/erotic about afterwards where he is buckling his belt while Michael is eating the watermelon. Maybe the camera angle being so close-in...oddly funny vibe. I feel the whole Jan thing is stupidly overblown because the writers can\\\'t take the chance people won\\\'t like Michael anymore if he dumps Jan for Holly. PLEASE...they should grow a pair. We like Angela in spite of her bitchery. I just can\\\'t believe a successful corporate woman like Jan could change so much in such a short period of time. Imagine any other \\\"succesful\\\" character on the show being flushed like that....Jim, for instance. It doesn\\\'t work so well with a male, does it? Duder Mifflin leadership is all dude.
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Really great episode! I\'ve watched it three times, because there\'s so much packed into this. One example -the song that Jan sings \"Son of a Preacher Man\". The lyrics are about a secret rendezvous - much like the song she so loves of Hunter\'s - about a one night stand. Maybe this isn\'t a sperm bank baby after all? Wouldn\'t be surprised if Jan admits at some point that it\'s Hunter\'s baby. And what\'s with her demand that Michael not see Holly? Good for Michael for immediately defying her. He won\'t want Jan to know about Holly, Angela doesn\'t want Andy to know about Dwight, and no one knows what will become of Jim and Pam with their long distance romance - some really good plot lines to watch. Matt and Kevin, love your show - thanks for taking the time to do it. Even when I disagree, it\'s always interesting....even if the them song does grate a bit. :-)
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I didn\'t like this episode much. Dwight giving birth to a watermelon, Jan singing, and Stanley\'s issues turned me off. I am also a die-hard Jammer and want to see them together, so while the phone messages were sweet, they didn\'t do anything to redeem the episode for me.
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As for my thoughts on the episode, I liked parts of it. I found the stroller bit way over the top, as was Jan\'s concert, but I did like some of the \"sophomoric\" humor. Michael is the kind of dopey jackass that wouldn\'t understand that Astird isn\'t a name. Dwight\'s watermelon birth brought back memories of my recent delivery...but none of the good things about it. I loved the Michael/Holly action, though I can\'t believe she would put up with that from him. And I also loved the Jim/Pam tag, because I\'m a sucker that way. All in all, it made me laugh, wince, roll my eyes, and get a little mistyeyed. Not necessarily in that order.
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I am a JAM lover and a romantic at heart, so I that part of me did enjoy the final scene when they call each other at the same time and leave the overlapping voicemail. I get the point that even on an \"off day\", they\'re still obviously so in sync with each other. But the voice in the back of my mind kept nagging me about how it seemed so bizarre that they both seemingly gave up on having a real conversation that day. Assuming Jim and Pam maintain average bedtimes, there\'s still another six hours in the day to find time to talk. I want some JAM angst to keep things fresh and interesting, but this felt unrealistic and too contrived for me. Overall, the episode had some redeeming moments, but overall wasn\'t anything special. The two deleted scenes have been funnier than the Dwight plot line. It\'s too bad that the product placement was involved with that because a scene with the destroyed stroller would have made it worth it. Instead, I think they put too much time into it without any final payoff.
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Wow. I just started listening to the podcast and wanted to check out the site but TWSS Matt is acting like a dick. No wonder TWSS isn\'t the best Office Podcast. Well, it\'s REALLY not any wonder since you also know nothing about Season One or the original UK Office. Podcast deleted.
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The episode wasn\'t great, but it did have a few shining moments. The cold open was way over the top but pretty funny. Holly was great. The scene where Jan woke up and Holly said the baby was making sales calls and on a coffee break had me chuckling. I also laughed when Michael told Holly he was going to give her and Ryan the cold shoulder. Dwight\'s \"playtime is over\" line when he threw the stroller was pretty funny too. So the product placement was blatant...and painful. The rest of the episode was at least OK.
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Jan\'s singing was supposed to be annoying. LOL It was the first thing Jim told Pam during their conversation while she was in the laundromat. At that point she had been singing for 20 minutes. Ah, maybe I\'m just in a giddy mood. I agree that showing the shoulder after all of Dwight\'s abuse would have been a good ending.
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Well Matt, you are not alone. I didn’t like this one much either. I found it more disturbing than funny. Perhaps it was the EW! factor: Dwight “breaking his water” into a trashcan and with his pants down writhing on Michael’s desk, “I circumcised myself”, Stanley’s nipple sensitivity, Creed wrapping his foot, afterbirth floats, etc. It seems someone out there must be clamoring to see Rainn Wilson with his pants off. (I’m admittedly lumping in his movie roles here.) Well it isn’t me and I don’t find it funny, please stop. I agree, the stroller testing might have been salvaged for me if they had shown a reaction shot from Jan when she opens her trunk at the end or something. I might have liked it more if Dwight’s approach was less manic and more methodical, like Myth Busters. Some things I did like: Jim’s family tree chart. The Jim and Pam overlapping voicemail at the end. Angela trying to take an Anne Geddes style photo of Astrid. (It would have been nice to see an Oscar reaction shot to this to tie it into the Jazz babies poster feud.) Marking the baby with a sharpie. (Was it Michael’s idea to mark the Bennihana waitress?) Michael tells Holly he’s also going to be cold to Ryan. (Although we never saw this.) The hug, and the fact that Michael defied Jan. Amy Ryan, her acting was great as usual. I have to give the show credit for surprising me. I fully expected to see an episode with Jan going into labor and Michael completely freaking out. They skipped all that and it actually made sense that Jan would work around Michael. I hope Astrid turns out to be allergic to Jan’s candles.
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Was anyone else waiting for a scene where Jan gets home, and opens up her trunk and see\'s the stroller all trashed and broken up? Why did Dwight put it in her trunk if there wasn\'t anything he didn\'t want her to see? I really thought that was going to be the final scene. Another scene that would have been funny is if we saw Creed taking the other stroller that was left by the trash. Why would Creed take the stroller? Why does he need three office chairs?
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I didn\'t laugh very much with this episode, and it\'s my least favorite episode so far this season. The Dwight birthing scenario disgusted me, and Jan\'s singing was annoying. I know the Jim/Pam difficulties help portray them as a normal couple, but that doesn\'t make it any fun to watch. I wish they would have kept in the deleted scene about Kevin and the sperm bank. THAT was hilarious!
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That was one of the best episodes of the office ever. That cold open??? I had tears in my eyes I was laughing so hard. And Holly and Michael, I was soooo happy for them!!! Great one all around. It matches up there with Casino Night and Booze Cruise in my book.
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Is there really a difference between \"Thursday\" Matt and \"Few Days Later\" Matt? Seriously... ...Matt, like a druggy, is getting increasingly harder to please. I miss the good old days, before Matt was a blatant Jim basher. Now Matt\'s podcast is entirely meant to bully the show. Although he says he loves the show, you could never tell by the way he takes the show for granted. Don\'t even get me started on Kevin \"Last Man Left for the Job\" Crossman. Honestly, why do a Podcast about a show that you seemingly don\'t like, or can\'t appreciate. I honestly thought that Matt would finally lighten up this summer and that the podcast would be bearable, or possibly even good again. Apparently my hopes for this season of TWSS won\'t come to fruition. And I really wanted to say that i enjoy the show again and that i don\'t just listen to it for the clips from the office. Looks like that won\'t happen.
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This episode was both crap and great to me. The stroller thing was a bit overdone, I HATED Jan\'s singing (she has a decent voice but I just wanted her to stop) and a few characters that I usually like were annoying me. However I adored the Michael/Holly moment, the cold open and the Pam/Jim storyline. I also spent part of the episode wondering whether the baby was Angela\'s real life baby, she certainly seemed comfortable around the cast. Speaking of Angela, her and Andy seemed more like a couple to me this episode than ever before. Don\'t know exactly why, just a feeling I got.
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I loved the episode. I laughed the entire time. I thought the fact that they totally omitted showing Jan\'s labor was funny. She has a great voice, btw. I laughed at Phyllis\'s attempt to take a collection for the gift. \"It\'s not even his baby\". On a sad note, I was responsible for collecting money for a former co-worker after she miscarried her baby. People were reluctant to give because they never even knew she was pregnant. There was even a couple of aww moments. I thought it was cute how pam and jim left similar messages for each other and I adored the Michael/Holly hug. I was hoping he was going in for a kiss but a hug will do for now. Dwight\'s testing of the stroller reminded me of the cocktail party when he inspected David\'s home. It was a typical Dwight moment. LOL @ Stanley comparing his obesity issues to those of a pregnant woman.
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\"Jim/Pam conversations meant nothing... waste of time, bad days happen.\" Ben, I must respectfully disagree. I think the fact that \'bad days happen\' was the point of their story line. People are so worried (for example, me) that they\'re going to break them up like another, lesser sitcom might do, but instead they show us that Jim/Pam can have bad days and still they\'re absolutely meant to be together. I thought it was a nice glimmer of reality to offset Dwight\'s stroller testing. Kim, I really loved that Michael hugged her. (I thought he was going to kiss her too.) I thought it was really sweet -- even if he did ultimately have ulterior motives. (Checking to see if they connected instead of saying he\'s sorry for treating her like a jerk like Holly probably thought.) O.k. must. sleep. before I say anything truly stupid.
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A laugh-less mess? First off, we had \"I performed my own circumcision\" and \"DO YOU HAVE A SHARPIE\" and \"Nice touch\" just in the cold open. Andy\'s shudder at Angela\'s picture was priceless. Creed brings up Omaha Beach. And any time anyone says \"She smells like old tomatoes and dirt\" you know you want to chuckle. Really the Michael parts of this episode were what made it great. Dwight \'testing\' the stroller was a bit silly, and the Pam and Jim storyline, while okay, will never compare to \"The Carpet.\"
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Hey Matt I know I said my piece in the chatroom, but after seeing this episode three times, I have a more concise view of the ep. While the ep was both hilarious and dramatic in even tones, I think the main problem was the editing. Michael realizing that Astrid wasn\'t all that was cracked up to be and Jim and Pam\'s off day clashed with the cold open and Dwight\'s breaking in of the stroller (which I didn\'t see it as blatant product placement). It was as if NBC aired the still rough third cut rather than the refined final cut. I at least laughed at this ep, as opposed to \"Pilot\", Ben Franklin\" and \"Job Fair\" which were completely laughless and the wrst the series has had to offer. P.S. When Jan was singing \"Son of a Preacher Man\", did anyone think of PULP FICTION?
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Man I do hope this gets better on the second viewing. I give it half a star on Thursday. The Dwight stroller testing was really weird. I didn\'t expect Michael to go for Holly after what Jan said, but I\'m glad we saw that. Jan\'s singing was really weird and bad. I hated it. Jim/Pam conversations meant nothing... waste of time, bad days happen.
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I have to say, I enjoyed this episode quite a bit. For me, it had a little bit of everything - laughter, awkwardness, and touching moments. I especially enjoy sweet and vulnerable Michael making an appearance a few times per season. I hope your mind changes a little when you watch again, Matt - or else next week\'s podcast might bum me out. ;)
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That was a very touching episode......the whole....\"I felt nothing when I held Astrid......\" amazing and the Jim and Pam thing was great. My favourite part was the smile that Holly flashed when Michael was telling her that he was going to be mean to her.....aweswome acting
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O.k. so the episode wasn\'t as laugh-out-loud as I was hoping, but I DID love Jan\'s incessant singing. Ha ha. I SO know people like that! I also loved the shower games that were ruined by the baby being born. Loved the Michael/Holly moment. If I wasn\'t such a heartless wench (i.e. I never cry) I might have been teary. Finally, I loved that Pam and Jim are NORMAL. Thank you writers! I love the fact that as soon as they get each others messages, they\'ll realize what we all know. I love watching them going through normal relationship things instead of tv relationship things (those are fun too, don\'t get me wrong.) Anyway, I definitely need to watch again as I was watching with many people and I\'m sure I missed things.
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GREAT episode. Not in a \'Season 2\' sense, but just a good piece of television. Steve Carrell did a really nice job in this episode, and I really felt for him. Amy Ryan\'s \'dusty\' eyes at the end almost got me, too. I enjoyed Jim and Pam\'s \"conversation\" too. Just a good episode.
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Did they give the brand of that stroller? Because I\'m not sure a twelve hundred dollar price tag really recommends that thing. I didn\'t even know there were strollers that were so expensive; the most I\'ve heard of was $900. (My friend just had a baby. I\'ve been getting a stroller education by sheer osmosis.)
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I wasn\'t so into this episode, but I did appreciate Jim and Pam\'s non-conversation at the end. They may feel like they\'re in a funk, but at least the audience knows how closely connected they are. (And can I just say... Darryl looks just awful. It\'s unnerving.)
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So...I was a huge Michael/Jan fan, and even stuck by her last season when she went nuts. But after this episode? She can go. She can leave the show. It would make sense, in The Office world, for her to go. She was a great character in seasons 1-3, but like Roy, I think her time has come.
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Oh! But, I meant to say, LOVED the episode. I actually thought it did a good job of setting up Jan to go, if that\'s where the plot line is headed. Also, please, please don\'t leave Amy Ryan. I almost cried when he was \"testing Holly out\" at the end. Best line of the episode? \"That had to be like the beaches at Normandy.\" HA!
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So this is unrelated to the upcoming episode, but I just wanted Matt and/or Kevin to know that the chatroom isn\'t working for me. I don\'t know if its an isolated problem and my computer doesn\'t want me to interact with listeners of the TWSS podcast, which makes me sad, but I felt it was worth reporting...
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Great episode! Amy Ryan will break my heart if she doesn\\\'t stay on permanently. I have to say...it sure got \\\"dusty\\\" at the end there when Michael hugged Holly. I think the whole \\\"bad day\\\" thing with Jim & Pam is all just a ploy to get us worried about their relationship. It was refreshing to see Michael come through like that though. I love it when Michael is not Homer Simpson, but a real person. Good Dwight moments as well...that was a hilarious cold open. I really like Michael-focused episodes, even if really no other plot lines were seriously addressed. I can\\\'t wait to watch it again.
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